Episode 57
Rebuilding After Rock Bottom with Morgan Vance
This episode is one of those conversations that stays with you long after it ends. I sat down with my friend Morgan Vance, Executive Director of the Pat Summitt Foundation, and we talked about something that so many of us face but often feel alone in: what happens after you hit rock bottom?
Morgan opens up about walking through a painful divorce, the loneliness that followed, and the moment she found herself on her knees in her parents’ backyard, realizing she couldn’t do it on her own. But that wasn’t the end of her story — it was the beginning of a new one.
She shares how therapy, faith, and a simple bag of chips (yes, really) helped her rediscover joy and reclaim her identity. Her “one big thing”? That there’s always a reason to praise — even in the middle of the mess.
If you’re in a hard season right now — whether it’s divorce, depression, anxiety, or just feeling stuck — I want you to know you’re not alone. Morgan’s story is a reminder that healing is possible, joy is real, and sometimes the smallest moments can be the most powerful.
We also talk about the incredible work she’s doing through the Pat Summitt Foundation to support families impacted by Alzheimer’s, and how you can get connected if that’s part of your journey too.
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About Morgan
Morgan is a proud wife and mother of five. She serves as the Executive Director of the Pat Summitt Foundation, charged with protecting the life and legacy of legendary women’s basketball coach Pat Summitt while advancing the organization’s mission in the fight against Alzheimer’s disease.
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Transcript
Welcome to the One Big Thing podcast where inspiration meets transformation.
Speaker A:I'm your host, Steve Campbell and I'm excited to have you join me today.
Speaker A:I welcome guests from all walks of life to the show.
Speaker A:We're going to spend about 30 minutes getting into their story and sharing the one big thing that they want to share with all of you that can help you move the forward in your life.
Speaker A:So thank you for being my guest in the One Big Thing and enjoy this episode.
Speaker B:Marriage is difficult.
Speaker B:God never said that it was easy.
Speaker B:You have to fight for it, you have to work at it every day.
Speaker B:But there are some biblical reasons for pursuing a divorce, but I was just so, I was so scared to do that.
Speaker B:But for me, I just remember it was really early on in the divorce and I was at my parents house and I, it was the first time I ever truly felt alone.
Speaker B:Like I can tell you exactly where I was standing in their yard, where I was facing the sun that was shining.
Speaker B:And I just remember falling to my knees in that moment and thinking, this is what it's like to hit rock bottom.
Speaker B:Like, this is what loneliness is.
Speaker B:But from that point it was a, I am never going to survive this on my own.
Speaker B:And again, I have phenomenal family, I had great support system, great friends, but I just, I knew that, like, I need so much more than that to get me through this.
Speaker B:And from that moment on, it was a like, okay, God, I'm giving this all, I'm giving this to you.
Speaker B:I'm not going to make it unless.
Speaker B:Unless you're in control.
Speaker A:Welcome to the One Big Thing podcast.
Speaker A:I'm your host, Steve Campbell.
Speaker A:Excited to have a good friend, Morgan Vance on with me today.
Speaker A:I met Morgan over coffee, gosh, a couple months ago.
Speaker A:Now, if you've been trekking with the show, I told you, my wife and I relocated to East Tennessee outside the KN Knoxville area about four years ago.
Speaker A:And in part of my day to day job, it's getting to know difference makers in the community and find out what they're working on.
Speaker A:And I came across the name Morgan Vance from a mutual friend who said she's doing some incredible work in the Knoxville area and she was kind enough to meet up for me with coffee and over the course of an hour felt like we just kind of knew each other and got to know each other and the amazing things we're working on.
Speaker A:I said, hey, you know, I kind of host this podcast that I've been doing on the side for a few years where I just want to help people that I think are doing incredible things.
Speaker A:Come on and share with really.
Speaker A:They're one big thing that could help inspire you wherever you're listening today.
Speaker A:Kind of move the ball forward in your life.
Speaker A:So, Morgan Vance, want to invite you to the podcast.
Speaker A:For those that may not know you, though, maybe what's a few things here right at the beginning you might think might be helpful to know about you?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, thank you for having me.
Speaker B:I'm excited to be here.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So a little bit about me.
Speaker B:I'm a Knoxville girl, born and raised, went to UT for undergrad, spent pretty much my entire career in the nonprofit field and landed where I am now, which is the Past Seminar Foundation.
Speaker B:I'm the executive director of the foundation after serving in a few different roles with them.
Speaker B:So that's my professional life, but my personal life, I am the proud mom of five kids and hopefully my husband would say I'm a very devoted wife.
Speaker B:I think he would.
Speaker B:But I'm a proud wife and mom, very family oriented.
Speaker A:And you're doing incredible work.
Speaker A:And before we even kind of jump into your one big thing, for those that aren't from the Knoxville area, maybe the name Pat Summitt is synonymous with women's basketball because of the work she did at ut.
Speaker A:But why don't you just help people, maybe right here at the beginning, understand the Pat Summit foundation and the work that you do as an executive director.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So our job at the foundation is to honor the life and legacy of Coach Summit while advancing the mission and her mission in the fight against Alzheimer's disease.
Speaker B:So we advance research, provide support for patients and caregivers, and promote education and awareness.
Speaker B: g this work since November of: Speaker B:And we are just rocking and rolling.
Speaker B:It's been an incredible year.
Speaker B:So our job is, is to protect her legacy, but also make sure that we are moving the needle forward and the fight against Alzheimer's disease.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And for.
Speaker A:For people that have never kind of experienced Alzheimer's, I mean, is there like an easy way to explain kind of what it is and how it affects somebody?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's a neurodegenerative disease.
Speaker B:And really that's just a fancy medical term for saying that you're brain slowly loses function over time and so it is not a curable disease.
Speaker B:Unfortunately, there have been some advances and medicines over the last several years, some different treatment options, which are.
Speaker B:Which is phenomenal.
Speaker B:But there is no.
Speaker B:There's no treatment.
Speaker B:There's no cure for Alzheimer's disease.
Speaker B:So it impacts everyone differently.
Speaker B:I think a lot of times if anyone is familiar with the disease, they think, oh, this person who has it, they just won't remember.
Speaker B:Remember me, but think about all the things that your brain controls.
Speaker B:You know, me picking up a coffee mug, me recalling your name, me remembering how to eat and swallow.
Speaker B:And so there's your brain control so much.
Speaker B:And then, you know, to slowly lose that over time.
Speaker B:It's a really, it's devastating, absolutely devastating disease.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I think when you and I connected over coffee, I'd shared that, you know, I've, outside of this, I've been in the financial planning world for, gosh, about the last 12 or 13 years.
Speaker A:And I, and I don't do the numbers and figures, but I'm very involved in the client experience side or the knowing people side of it.
Speaker A:And Alzheimer's is one of those things that no one ever asked for.
Speaker A:And when you're in the thick of it, it's just very hard.
Speaker A:And you can plan for the money aspect your entire life and putting money away for your future, but when you have a physical thing that hits you health wise, especially when it's spouse or a parent, and it just, you see the toll that it takes on individuals.
Speaker A:I think that's why it was very near and dear to my heart when I talked with you, because you are with the Pat Summit foundation providing care, support, resources to people that never asked to go through something like this and they're, they're struggling to make sense of it.
Speaker A:And then you even have family members or friends that want to know, like, how should I support them?
Speaker A:And so the network, even though it is set up through Pat Summit's foundation, actually I think from what you had told me, has a pretty large footprint across the country in terms of providing support.
Speaker A:And you know, we'll probably unpack more of that as we go through this today.
Speaker A:But the whole concept of this show is there's a lot of people out there struggling today, myself included.
Speaker A:That's why I started the show.
Speaker A:Four kids, married, trying to figure out season of life.
Speaker A:Maybe you are in the camp that's dealt with somebody with Al Alzheimer's.
Speaker A:Maybe you've gone through depression, anxiety, or just have a lot of life questions right now.
Speaker A:And I wanted to create a space where individuals could come on from walks of life to share.
Speaker A:Like, this is the one big thing that if I had an opportunity to speak in front of people, I would say this is what it's all about this is what I'm learning in this season of life.
Speaker A:And so, Morgan Vance, if I had to ask you, what is your one big thing?
Speaker A:What would you want to tell a listener today?
Speaker B:Yeah, for me, my one big thing.
Speaker B:And I really adapted this several years ago when I went through a really difficult season.
Speaker B:And that is you always have a reason to praise.
Speaker B:No matter what you are going through, no matter what you're experiencing, there is always a reason to praise.
Speaker A:And for you, I mean, you share as much as your story and how personal you want to get.
Speaker A:When you say a really difficult hard season, I mean, how much there's always a reason to praise.
Speaker A:Where.
Speaker A:Where did that come from?
Speaker A:What did we learn through what.
Speaker A:What are some of the things or challenges that you've experienced in your life?
Speaker B:Yeah, so I.
Speaker B:About five years ago, I was going through a divorce after a very difficult marriage, and then found myself just at.
Speaker B:I mean, rock bottom, single mom, two kids.
Speaker B:My entire life, all I had ever wanted to do, the constant there was be a mom.
Speaker B:And then suddenly I found myself sharing custody, going through periods of time without my children being with me.
Speaker B:And so just really had to learn how to shift my perspective.
Speaker B:And then it just did.
Speaker B:It truly amazed me when I shifted that perspective, when I started looking for, okay, what are all the reasons that I have to be grateful?
Speaker B:And then taking it one step further and actually giving praise, actually thanking God for these.
Speaker B:These little moments that I was seeing throughout the day and these doors that he was opening, the things that he was doing, I started to realize, like, okay, so this is what it means when he talks about joy and having peace that surpasses all understanding.
Speaker B:And so it was just this, like, season of learning and growing and really growing closer in my relationship to God.
Speaker B:But then it's been amazing to see how.
Speaker B:Just how that is still true.
Speaker B:Like, not just in my personal life, but in my professional life as well.
Speaker B:Like, it's.
Speaker B:It's just if anyone could take anything away, like, I really hope that when someone, after they meet me, after they talk to me, if they hear this, that they walk away knowing, like.
Speaker B:Or just sensing that joy, you know, that, oh, wow, this person really does have joy.
Speaker B:This person really isn't a great place.
Speaker B:This person.
Speaker B:What is different?
Speaker B:Well, this is what's different.
Speaker A:Yeah, well.
Speaker A:And I've had the pleasure of having coffee with people over 12 years from every walk of life.
Speaker A:And I. I will tell you that there is a light about you that from the first moment we met, I was like, man, there's something different about her.
Speaker A:And it's, it's, I think my wife has that, so kudos to you, Stephanie.
Speaker A:I totally married up.
Speaker A:My wife has this light and aura about her that no matter where I take her, even if, even if she's down or struggling with things herself, man, when she gets in a room full of people, it is not about her.
Speaker A:And I don't think it's a show.
Speaker A:I don't think it's an actual, she just has a genuine interest in people, in, in supporting them and loving them.
Speaker A:And when we leave events, people always tell me, man, I love your wife.
Speaker A:She's so much fun, she's so great.
Speaker A:And it's because she cares.
Speaker A:And I think you have that same thing about you.
Speaker A:A couple of questions that I think are maybe helpful too.
Speaker A:There's always reason to praise.
Speaker A:Let's unpack that a little bit.
Speaker A:Did you grow up, did you grow up in church or was faith a part of your family background?
Speaker A:Kind of growing up?
Speaker B:I did, I grew up in church.
Speaker B:But my pastor loves to say that there are no grandchildren in the kingdom of God.
Speaker B:There's only children.
Speaker B:So I did grow up and, and you know, I had a relationship, but it wasn't until like I went through this period, like, I would always, I would consider myself a Christian.
Speaker B:Like I had dedicated, I'd given him my life.
Speaker B:I had called in my Lord and Savior, I was baptized, but I was, you know, still a young something.
Speaker B:Not always, you know, really living for him and then walking through that time that I would, I mean that seven, eight years really grew closer.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, but yeah, always I had great parents.
Speaker B:You know, I had the parents that, you know, would gather us around.
Speaker B:We had dinner together every night pretty much until we got to like later in high school when like there's practices and games and no one's there at the same time.
Speaker B:So we did family dinners every night.
Speaker B:My parents would pray over us.
Speaker B:We were at church every Sunday morning, Sunday night and Wednesday night.
Speaker B:You know, very active and involved in church.
Speaker A:Well, and you can be active and involved, but until your faith is really put into the crosshairs of what do I really believe.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And so I, I, I probably wouldn't assume that divorce is something you just one day are like, you know what?
Speaker A:I'm going to get a divorce.
Speaker A:It's probably a slow burn that it sounds like from what I heard was over a seven or eight year period.
Speaker A:So was, was there things that for you helped you in the midst of.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:You get married you say, you know, forever do his part, and then all of a sudden things don't go the way that they were scripted in your mind.
Speaker A:How did you make sense of that time?
Speaker A:Was there anything that from a practical standpoint helped you kind of in the midst of what you were going through?
Speaker B:Yeah, you know, we, we tried.
Speaker B:You know, I really, I don't, I'm one of those people.
Speaker B:Divorce is not the answer.
Speaker B:So a little bit more about my background.
Speaker B:So I was raised by my dad and my stepmom who actually later on went on to adopt me.
Speaker B:So that was when I thought about future family.
Speaker B:What I always said was, one engagement, one marriage.
Speaker B:I will, I will never get divorced.
Speaker B:My children will never, ever.
Speaker B:Like, I had the most incredible parents and grew up in this really stable home.
Speaker B:However, the divorce still affected me and I never wanted my kids to go through that and to question some of the things that I questioned, to have some of the doubts, the thoughts that they did.
Speaker B:And so, yeah, we, you know, tried a lot and thankfully, you know, I did have my parents who had been through this before as well, and so, you know, talked through them.
Speaker B:But I was actually really hesitant.
Speaker B:I think I knew pretty early on that like, oh boy, this is not what marriage is supposed to be.
Speaker B:But I was really, I think, just scared to take that step because again, I don't believe, I think people are, you should fight your.
Speaker B:For your marriage.
Speaker B:Marriage is difficult.
Speaker B:Like, God never said that it was easy.
Speaker B:You have to fight for it, you have to work at it every day.
Speaker B:But there are some biblical reasons for pursuing a divorce.
Speaker B:But I was just so, I was so scared to do that.
Speaker B:And then we had a whole lot of other things happen.
Speaker B:But for me, I just, I remember it was really early on in the divorce and I was at my parents house and I.
Speaker B:It was the first time I ever truly felt alone.
Speaker B:Like, I can tell you exactly where I was standing in their yard where I was facing the sun that was shining.
Speaker B:And I just remember falling to my knees in that moment and thinking, this is what it's like to hit rock bottom.
Speaker B:Like, this is what loneliness is.
Speaker B:But from that point it was a. I am never going to survive this on my own.
Speaker B:And again, I have phenomenal family.
Speaker B:I had great support system, great friends.
Speaker B:But I just, I knew that, like, I need so much more than that to get me through this.
Speaker B:And from that moment on it was a, like, okay, God, I'm giving this all, I'm giving this to you.
Speaker B:I'm not going to make it Unless you're in control, I can't fix this.
Speaker B:I can't do this on my own.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so for you and me, and I've had other guests where faith.
Speaker A:Faith in the Lord is a huge part of my life.
Speaker A:And there was.
Speaker A:For me, there was a season of my life where I grew up in a church.
Speaker A:I walked away being a Division 1 athlete from what I knew from my parents growing up and partied and did everything under the sun.
Speaker A:And there was a loneliness aspect to that.
Speaker A:You know, got.
Speaker A:Found myself in situations that I was like, how did I end up here?
Speaker A:And when.
Speaker A:When your faith is questioned, I think for me, I got to a point too, where I. I kind of in full surrender, said, God, if you really are who you.
Speaker A:Who you say you are, I've learned about you, but now I need you to take over, because I can't do this.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And for each person, we have to get to our own.
Speaker A:Like, no one can tell you what that's like, hitting rock bottom.
Speaker A:Whether it's divorce, whether it's infertility, whether it's the loss of a loved one, whether it's bankruptcy, like, you name it, you know what rock bottom is.
Speaker A:When you close your eyes and say, what is the lowest point of my life been.
Speaker A:And I think what you and I can testify to is we got to that point.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And maybe the.
Speaker A:Maybe the hard part for people is if you grew up in church or you say you have a life of faith, like, why is this happening to me?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:But I think what I'm hearing from your story is the one big thing is there's always a reason to praise, but it's also too, like, your story's not over.
Speaker A:And so I. I would assume you would encourage people that maybe have been through divorce.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:To know they're not alone.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But even just Morgan, how about for those people that are, you know, in the midst of one thing that you did say, which I appreciate, is you tried.
Speaker A:Like, what.
Speaker A:What does that look like for somebody who's been in the midst of a very hard situation trying?
Speaker A:And you know what.
Speaker A:What are some things that maybe you could encourage somebody who's like, I. I don't know about all of this.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So even that, when I think back to.
Speaker B:And I say I tried, it was still me trying to force the things to happen.
Speaker B:It was me trying to change that.
Speaker B:It was.
Speaker B:It was still very much in me.
Speaker B:And to even.
Speaker B:I mean, you're trying.
Speaker B:I think there is still a moment where you have to sit and say, I've got to surrender this, I've got to surrender this, and you've got to change your mindset.
Speaker B:I mean, to your point, like, why is this happening to me?
Speaker B:And I think one of the things that really helped shift my perspective was that I truly then, and I'll say I did not do all of this alone.
Speaker B:When people ask me how I survived this, I say Jesus and Doug.
Speaker B:Doug was my therapist that I saw weekly.
Speaker B:I mean, he was incredible.
Speaker B:But it was through working with him and just really getting into God's word, I realized really quickly that I had to learn exactly who God was, was, and why the why behind these things happen.
Speaker B:He does not want bad things to happen to us, but he does use these difficult seasons to draw us to him, to grow our faith.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And so it was that shift in my mindset of, okay, this, this is terrible.
Speaker B:Like, this is never what I wanted.
Speaker B:How am I going to survive this?
Speaker B:Oh my gosh, are we going to be okay?
Speaker B:Just all of those questions, the why, why, why's.
Speaker B:And instead it shifted to, okay, God, there's something that you want me to learn from this?
Speaker B:Open my eyes.
Speaker B:You know, I prayed a lot for wisdom and discernment of God.
Speaker B:Just show me, lead me, guide me, teach me again.
Speaker B:It was that place of surrender.
Speaker B:And so I would, I would say that, you know, I would encourage people to try to shift their mindset and shift the questions that they're asking internally to the what is it that I am supposed to learn from this?
Speaker B:You know, what is it that you are wanting me to see?
Speaker B:What is it that you're wanting me?
Speaker B:What area are you wanting me to grow in?
Speaker B:I would really encourage people to just shift those questions.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And maybe, Morgan, the Jesus part is really hard for people to conceptualize, but maybe the Doug part is a lot easier.
Speaker A:You didn't mention that.
Speaker A:And so I don't want to ever ask anything that's out of bounds.
Speaker A:I've had a couple of guests in the past that have talked about therapy and now and how it helped them.
Speaker A:And therapy, I think is one of those things that can be over romantized.
Speaker A:But it's like, if you need help, just take medicine, get therapy.
Speaker A:But then there's also a taboo of like, I don't want to acknowledge that I need help.
Speaker A:So for somebody that has gone through therapy, the decision making tree to help somebody that might be in something to know like what, when is it time to get help beyond.
Speaker A:I'm not saying to ever take the place of Prayer.
Speaker A:But there are practical ways, like therapy.
Speaker A:Did you know that you needed therapy?
Speaker A:Did somebody recommend therapy?
Speaker A:And then what was that process like for you to find a Doug?
Speaker B:Yeah, so.
Speaker B:So a lot of people recommended therapy.
Speaker B:My mom was one of the first ones.
Speaker B:And this is where I say, this was one of the reasons I really struggled.
Speaker B:And kind of improbably stayed.
Speaker B:We stayed longer than we probably should have was because we constantly tried marriage counseling, which is great, but it wasn't.
Speaker B:What.
Speaker B:It wasn't right for us.
Speaker B:And I think it finally got to the point where it was like, I need someone.
Speaker B:See, someone recommended.
Speaker B:It went through a crisis, and someone recommended.
Speaker B:And they said, I think, have you thought about talking to someone?
Speaker B:And it was the first time that I had ever given consideration that it was okay for me to talk to someone on my own, that I didn't have to do it with my spouse at that time.
Speaker B:And then it was just a matter of finding someone that I was comfortable with.
Speaker B:And again, my therapist shared my same values, so he was able to bring both aspects to it of, like, he understood.
Speaker B:He knew that I believed what my beliefs were, but he also could really help support just the.
Speaker B:The things that I was going through.
Speaker B:You know, the being by myself for, like, again, the first time ever, you know, I went from college to living next door to my parents, to immediately getting married, to having that and then having kids really quickly.
Speaker B:Like, it was truly the first time ever in my adult life that I had been allowed.
Speaker B:And so we worked through a lot of that.
Speaker B:So I. I would think, you know, for me, it was that when I recognized that it was okay to get help and that I wanted the.
Speaker B:My future to be different, that was where it was an okay thing for me of like, yep, I need a. I need a therapist.
Speaker B:I need someone who can do this with me.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Because life's too short, right?
Speaker A:In.
Speaker A:In a.
Speaker A:In my.
Speaker A:My fears that the person feels they're without hope and does something tragic to themselves.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And so I've spoken openly in the show that my brother went through depression for years.
Speaker A:And so I understand mental health to the degree of what I experience as a brother.
Speaker A:But when you go through.
Speaker A:Again, I like to get really practical about this stuff, because if you've piqued somebody interest who's ever considered therapy or they just don't know was.
Speaker A:Was.
Speaker A:Did you interview Doug once?
Speaker A:Did you interview a couple of therapists?
Speaker A:Like, what.
Speaker A:What is that process like to find somebody that you're going to be openly intimate in terms of Sharing things like, what.
Speaker A:What was that like for you?
Speaker B:So I had a really unique experience.
Speaker B:So when I found Doug, he actually came to me via recommendation.
Speaker B:So we were actually in Baltimore, and I had started seeing someone there.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:And I would also say I. I also did group therapy in Baltimore, and that was different for me, and it was incredible.
Speaker B:It was a wonderful experience because I immediately walked in with, like, four other people who.
Speaker B:Who were going through the exact same thing that I was.
Speaker B:And so I wasn't looked at as crazy.
Speaker B:Like, when I would dip my toe in and say, like, well, I experienced this, they didn't look at me like I was crazy.
Speaker B:They supported me.
Speaker B:They shared their.
Speaker B:Their shared experiences.
Speaker B:And so I immediately felt like, okay, I have a community.
Speaker B:I'm not alone.
Speaker B:And that that was first step, like, recognizing again, I was not alone.
Speaker B:But, yes, we were in Baltimore and then ended up very quickly back home in Knoxville.
Speaker B:And so my therapist in Baltimore, who I'd only seen a couple of times, is.
Speaker B:He recommended Doug.
Speaker B:And so I met with him the first time, and truthfully, I was really skeptical of meeting with him the first time because he was a guy, and some of the things that I was going through was like, am I comfortable talking to a guy about this?
Speaker B:And we at met that first time, and I shared, you know, just again, a little bit about me personally, my beliefs, and that's.
Speaker B:And felt like, okay, this is the person that I want to work through this with.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:You know, in past, when we found marriage counselors, I would ask for recommendations from people that I trusted, and.
Speaker B:And we would go and see them, and.
Speaker B:And I'd ask for recommendations from, like, a couple different people and find the one that aligned, or if there was one person who.
Speaker B:Multiple people or one group that multiple people recommended, that's.
Speaker B:That's what we would go with.
Speaker B:So I think that it just.
Speaker B:Truthfully, I think it looks a little different for everyone, but the first step is really being willing to ask and say, like, hey, I'm thinking about talking to someone.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Would you recommend anyone?
Speaker B:You know, getting on the Google and seeing who's around you and what's around you.
Speaker B:Again, it was very important for me to have someone who shared my faith, who shared my values, and so that was a big part of who I would try to find.
Speaker B:It probably looks a lot different for everyone.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But the fact is, you acknowledge that it was time to get help.
Speaker A:And I think what's hard is whether you've gone through divorce, you're in marriage, when you talked about the life stages of being in high school, going to college, then getting married.
Speaker A:It's easy to blink.
Speaker A:And you're 38, 39 years old, and you're like, so much of my identity is being a dad to my kids or being a husband to my wife.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But like, who am I?
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:And so I think maybe then when you finally have this opportunity, going through a hard season of life to finally just focus on, you know, Morgan, it probably was not shocking, but like, you really have to think about your own values and what you want, because so much of what you value gets wrapped up into I'm with this person or we have these children.
Speaker A:So has there, you know, when you went through kind of therapy again from the very practical side, was it, is it something that you're still ongoing seeking?
Speaker A:Was it Doug got you to a certain point and then you've self maintained and then like, what are the things that coming out of therapy have helped you stay in the right frame of mind to know that you can always give praise?
Speaker A:Are there things that you do on a daily basis that help you?
Speaker B:So Doug got me to a certain point and then I've been able to maintain.
Speaker B:But it's also really funny because I randomly run into Doug at like coffee shops and stuff because he's obviously here in this community.
Speaker B:And so we get these moments where we're like, I'm still doing okay, like we, we celebrate.
Speaker B:Um, but no, you know, Doug got me to a certain point.
Speaker B:He got me through that crisis.
Speaker B:And then, you know, for me, what was really big was I never want to be in that same position again.
Speaker B:And so it was very practical steps, or really for me, it was like being able to recognize red flags and being okay with walking away from situations or from certain people and different things.
Speaker B:And so he helped me kind of develop kind of my, like, how do I evaluate these things and be willing to take the hard step?
Speaker B:I did have to go through a lot of like this discovery of who is Morgan?
Speaker B:What does she want for the future?
Speaker B:See, like, who is Morgan as the professional?
Speaker B:Who is Morgan now as a mom when she doesn't have her kids all the time, and who's Morgan as this individual?
Speaker B:So it was a big discovery period.
Speaker B:And I would say the biggest thing that I walked away from my time with with Doug and that I still.
Speaker B:And my husband and I, like, he recognizes this and he has been so good.
Speaker B:Like when I say like just God's redemption, I mean it just.
Speaker B:I have the most incredible husband, but he helps me do this now.
Speaker B:And that is that it's okay to.
Speaker B:To like, talk about.
Speaker B:To verbalize the hard thing.
Speaker B:Like, it is growing up for me, like, my family was just not the greatest yet.
Speaker B:Like, I would, you know, get upset about something, and my family would be really quick to be like, yeah, but.
Speaker B:And we.
Speaker B:We kind of skipped over the emotions part and just went on to the.
Speaker B:We'll think about this other positive thing.
Speaker B:And what I learned from Doug was.
Speaker B:And that I still do is that, like, my husband and I. I'll sit and.
Speaker B:And I'll say, like, I'm really feeling this.
Speaker B:And we'll, like, it's okay for me to acknowledge it because when I'm.
Speaker B:When I acknowledge it, when I say it out loud, I'm no longer, like, sitting with it like a weight on my chest.
Speaker B:I can get it off, and then I can start processing it and I can start moving on.
Speaker B:But ignoring it never helped.
Speaker B:You know, like, ignoring the feelings, not addressing them, not.
Speaker B:Not verbalizing them.
Speaker B:Like, that never helped, but it's okay.
Speaker B:Like, acknowledging the hard thing is not dismissing the great things that God is doing in my life.
Speaker B:It's not dismissing the wonderful things.
Speaker B:Life is hard.
Speaker B:And it's okay to acknowledge that.
Speaker B:It's okay to say that.
Speaker B:I also have a really bad habit.
Speaker B:I don't know if you do this.
Speaker B:My husband and I call it doomsday.
Speaker B:So if one thing happens, like, I can doomsday that to the absolute worst possible possible scenario in my mind, and then I. I can just like, fixate on that.
Speaker B:And then everything starts to feel super heavy and it's like, not great.
Speaker B:So my husband will say, like, do you need a doomsday this?
Speaker B:And I'm like, yes, please.
Speaker B:And I say the absolute worst possible thing that has come through my head.
Speaker B:That once it's out there, I'm like, okay, that's not.
Speaker B:Oh, that's not that bad.
Speaker B:Or like, there's no way in the world that would ever happen.
Speaker B:And if it.
Speaker B:It did, like, here's how we would handle it.
Speaker B:Okay, we're good.
Speaker B:So we call it doomsday.
Speaker A:So I'm gonna have to.
Speaker A:You're like my dog.
Speaker A:Because I. I would say to my fault.
Speaker A:I am wired as a optimistic, glass overflowing person that the way that I guard myself is to the.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But my entire life and not realizing that that's not how my wife operates.
Speaker A:And if there's ever been friction in our marriage, I think it's because I have.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Butted most of what she's ever said to protect us and to make sure that we are honoring the Lord in, like.
Speaker A:My big thing is I never want to speak a negative word about anything that God has ever done, like, in my life.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So if there's a problem with our house, and it's like, our house drives me nuts.
Speaker A:And it does this.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Sometimes I take it as like, yeah, but, like, think about this.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:That has caused contention over the years because she's like, you're not hearing me.
Speaker A:And it's me more so.
Speaker A:And she's absolutely right.
Speaker A:So, Stephanie, I love you.
Speaker A:I'm sorry I do that sometimes.
Speaker A:I think it's me more so.
Speaker A:Trying to, like, guard us from going too far down.
Speaker A:Maybe we want to verbalize the doomsday thing, but it's like, I just don't want us to get to a point where it just becomes so easy to complain or be negative that then our hearts are, like, tempered with.
Speaker A:In a way, you know?
Speaker A:And so I. I am guilty of.
Speaker A:And maybe that's my own downfall, Morgan, is.
Speaker A:Is I think sometimes when hard happens, I don't allow myself to grieve.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:Like, that was tough.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I. Yeah.
Speaker A:But myself.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So it's like, I failed as a dad or whatever it may be.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:And I move on.
Speaker A:And I don't allow myself to acknowledge because I want to be strong, and I want to be full of faith.
Speaker A:And so I think there is.
Speaker A:I think there is a balancing act between, like, struggling in being a victim and then also acknowledging that life is hard.
Speaker A:So you have talked about the need for having a therapist in Doug, but when you say there's always reasons to praise outside of Doug, like, has there been anything else in your work life, in your personal life that has allowed you to.
Speaker A:To stay consistent?
Speaker A:Because it.
Speaker A:You go from, like, one hard thing, life just feels like you go from one hard thing to another.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So it's never just.
Speaker A:There's years of coasting.
Speaker A:So when the challenges is different, unique, and maybe even stronger, how have you maintained that heart posture of.
Speaker A:There's always reason to prai.
Speaker B:So first, I will say you are absolutely right.
Speaker B:It can be a slippery slope.
Speaker B:You.
Speaker B:You do have to guard your heart.
Speaker B:So, like, I mean, I even had.
Speaker B:I just went through a weekend.
Speaker B:Sorry, Jason.
Speaker B:That's my husband.
Speaker B:I just went through a really hard weekend where it was like, everything was just, like.
Speaker B:I was just not.
Speaker B:I was in a very negative place.
Speaker B:So every little thing, I was like, why?
Speaker B:Oh, my gosh, that's happening again.
Speaker B:I mean, I. I did not guard my heart, so.
Speaker B:So you.
Speaker B:There's a slippery slope.
Speaker B:You do have to be mindful of that.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And I'll even say, like, having a mindset like this, it does take work.
Speaker B:Like, I didn't wake up one day and say, okay, now we're gonna be just super joyful all the time, 24 7.
Speaker B:Like, it took work and definitely still have my moments.
Speaker B:But it is something that I feel like I would.
Speaker B:I would wake up and it was like, little practical things.
Speaker B:And this is going to sound really silly, but the one that still stands out to me to this day was we were divorced, or we were going through the divorce, and I went to the grocery store for, like, one of the first times since we had separated, and I was, like, going down the aisle, and we ate really healthy.
Speaker B:Like, really healthy.
Speaker B:And that was a really contentious spot in our marriage, was arguing over, like, well, it's okay to have this thing every now and then.
Speaker B:Or, like, having a cupcake is not going to kill anyone.
Speaker B:You know, it's like these little things that just would blow up.
Speaker B:And I sat down, or I was going through the grocery store and I came on the chip aisle, which was always Armageddon for us.
Speaker B:And I started.
Speaker B:I was like, oh, I can't.
Speaker B:And then I. I was like, wait a second.
Speaker B:Yes, I can.
Speaker B:I can make this decision.
Speaker B:I can buy us a bag of chips.
Speaker B:And I bought us a bag of chips.
Speaker B:The boys at us.
Speaker B:And got in the car, and I called my mom and was like, tears in my eyes, and was like, you will never guess what I just did.
Speaker B:I bought chips.
Speaker B:And that was, for me, this, like, moment where it kind of flipped of, like, every little day.
Speaker B:There are little things like this happening.
Speaker B:Like little.
Speaker B:These tiny little moments that I don't want to take for granted.
Speaker B:Um, and so it was an.
Speaker B:Actively working to seek those things out.
Speaker B:And so even now.
Speaker B:And it's funny, my mom did this when I was growing up, and I always rolled my eyes, and I thought it was the silliest thing ever.
Speaker B:But my mom, we'd be driving.
Speaker B:I mean, we live.
Speaker B:We live in East Tennessee.
Speaker B:It is one of the most beautiful places on earth.
Speaker B:And especially in the fall.
Speaker B:And my mom would drive through and she would say, thank you, God, for the beautiful colors of the leaves.
Speaker B:Oh, they're changing.
Speaker B:Thank you, God.
Speaker B:Oh, thank you, God, for this beautiful field of flowers.
Speaker B:And growing up, I was like, what is up with her?
Speaker B:Like, okay.
Speaker B:But that is what I started doing.
Speaker B:And so even now I'm like, I've become my mom.
Speaker B:And I hope my kids learn and appreciate this.
Speaker B:That like we will drive and we'll see a sunset or sunrise and I'll say, thank you, God, for, for this day, for the beautiful colors, this beautiful place that we live at.
Speaker B:And so that is a small part of how I maintain is just truly finding one little thing every day that I can just thank God for or just be super grateful for or say, this is different.
Speaker B:I'm glad I had this chance.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:It truly, it's the same in my work.
Speaker B:I think one of the things that has really helped is, and I would say your circle matters.
Speaker B:You know, my friends, I have friends these days where I do when I feel like I am just really struggling and I am spiraling or I've let this little thing become this huge thing, I will call and I call them my rational friends and I'll say, hey, I need my rational friend right now.
Speaker B:Please help me just like talk through this and like help me feel grounded.
Speaker B:And so my circle matters.
Speaker B:And I would.
Speaker B:That's one of the ways that I maintain this at this point, perspective.
Speaker B:And I.
Speaker B:And again, I do it in work too.
Speaker B:Like, it's not just about, you know, my personal life, my personal walk with God.
Speaker B:I understand that that is different for everyone.
Speaker B:But in work, it's an opportunity.
Speaker B:You know, I work in a non profit and our whole goal is to work ourselves out of a job.
Speaker B:I mean, like, if I'm doing my job right, I shouldn't be working in 20, 30 years.
Speaker B:And, and so for us it's being able to every day say, how have I moved the needle forward a little bit?
Speaker B:We're going to celebrate that.
Speaker B:We're going to, we're going to, we're going to call that out.
Speaker A:Do you remember, do you remember the Brett, the band of chips you got?
Speaker A:Do you remember what they were?
Speaker B:Honest to goodness, I think it was like some lay salt and vinegar, like, or maybe it was Pringles.
Speaker B:I can't, I can't remember, but I just remember like it, it was just that little thing.
Speaker B:It was, yeah, it was this freeing moment of like, this is a new day and we're not gonna, we're not gonna throw ourselves a pity party.
Speaker B:Yes, there are gonna be hard days.
Speaker B:Yes, they're going to be hard moments in this journey, but there are going to be a lot of positive things that come out as well.
Speaker B:And we're, we're going to start focusing on Those things.
Speaker A:I think this is why I love the conversation, because I think it would.
Speaker A:It would be very easy as a listener to have beautiful Morgan Vance on screen if you're watching this with us and say, there's always reason to praise.
Speaker A:And maybe you started this episode in a very hard place in life right now.
Speaker A:And it just sounds like, oh, God, not another episode about how I gotta choose joy.
Speaker A:But then over the course of the last 35 minutes, you've explained that, like, you just had a weekend.
Speaker A:Like, you weren't choosing praise, you weren't choosing joy.
Speaker A:Like, you had to work for it.
Speaker A:And so I think that was my hope with this show, which is if we just saw you at a PAT Summit foundation event, you.
Speaker A:You shine like, you're.
Speaker A:You're beautiful, you're smart.
Speaker A:Like, just the way you present, it would be very easy to, from an outside perspective, view you and say, like, she just must have everything all figured out.
Speaker A:But in the course of the last 35 minutes, you talked about a very hard divorce and going through therapy and choosing to fight when it's hard and creating doomsday scenarios.
Speaker A:And, you know, these.
Speaker A:These things that I think will help people understand that if you find yourself in a hard season of life, realize you're not alone, that there's other people going through it, but to also verbalize what you are thankful for.
Speaker A:And I think for me, the biggest takeaway is to not circumvent or shortcut the, yeah, buts of life.
Speaker A:Don't just always try to find the positive, which sounds counterintuitive, but have time to grieve and go through things, but also make a plan of action for how you're going to get out of that.
Speaker A:And one of the things that I heard you say is one of the ways that you can do that daily is to verbalize just one small thing that you're thankful for.
Speaker A:And you learn that from your mom.
Speaker A:And now that's something you're trying to teach your kids.
Speaker A:And so that's a beautiful thing.
Speaker A:And so.
Speaker A:So to have this time to talk with you if you're out there today.
Speaker A:And I want to tell you, if you're going through some hard things, maybe therapy is the answer for you.
Speaker A:It may not be for every person, but do your due diligence.
Speaker A:Ask around.
Speaker A:Find somebody.
Speaker A:And Jeff Kavanaugh, who I had on the show, would swear by therapy because of what it did for him.
Speaker A:And so my goal is, let's have a couple practical takeaways, which we went through today, is there Anything else as we kind of come to a close here, Morgan, that you want to leave a listener with?
Speaker B:Yeah, I would say that I think one thing as I'm talking about it and as you're recapping, you know, I want people to understand there's a difference between happiness and joy.
Speaker B:And so, you know, that is one thing that I really learned as.
Speaker B:As I really adopted this.
Speaker B:Like, there is always a reason to praise.
Speaker B:There is always a reason to just, like, stop and give thanks.
Speaker B:And that is.
Speaker B:That's where I learned what true joy was.
Speaker B:We, again, we're all going to go through hard days, and those are the days where I would.
Speaker B:Yeah, we're not, like, emotionally the happiest people on Earth, but there's still this, like, joy that.
Speaker B:And so, I don't know.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker B:I think that's one thing for people to keep in mind, is that there's a difference.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And I would just.
Speaker B:There is a song that I used to listen to on repeat, and I remember a couple of years ago finding this.
Speaker B:I feel like it's been a couple years, but it's a song by Corey Asbury, and it's called Reason to Praise, and it does a phenomenal job of just describing that.
Speaker B:Of, like, when I see no way out.
Speaker B:When, like, all I see are walls, all I see are, you know, like, this big pit of, like, how on earth am I going to cross this?
Speaker B:Like, there is no way out.
Speaker B:Like, there is.
Speaker B:And you.
Speaker B:And you just got to cling to that.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And again, just acknowledge the hard look for the.
Speaker B:Look for the reasons to praise, and you'll.
Speaker B:You'll make it through.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I think what you just said, and it's a helpful way for me to close.
Speaker A:Journaling has always been something that I have sworn by, because I will tell you that if you go back through my journal over the last decade of my life, I have multiples of them.
Speaker A:The things I went through in a season of life seem like the hardest things that I would never get through.
Speaker A:And now I look back, and I, in remembrance, remember how God did it in a unique way each way, but got me out of it.
Speaker A:And every time he did it in a unique way, I learned an aspect of his character that I didn't understand before.
Speaker A:But I have a tendency to want to manufacture what God can do.
Speaker A:And so when he brought me through one miracle, the next time I'm faced with a difficult situation, I try to do exactly what I did the last time.
Speaker A:And that is my tendency that's why I played sports.
Speaker A:That's why I'm a disciplined person.
Speaker A:It's like, well, last time I just did this and God brought me through it.
Speaker A:What can happen then is then we try to redo what God did in one season of our life.
Speaker A:And he wants to do it through a simple song on repeat.
Speaker A:He wants to do it through a dog.
Speaker A:He wants to do it through a word that you hear or a sunset that you stare at.
Speaker A:So don't.
Speaker A:I would just encourage you as a listener.
Speaker A:Don't ever shortchange that.
Speaker A:If God is speaking so clearly to you in a season of life right now, in a way he never has, that's probably how he wants to get you through.
Speaker A:And it could just be staring off at the sweet, you know, Smoky Mountains that we got.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:And so for you, Morgan, I want to say thank you.
Speaker B:I want to say, yeah, that's a big one.
Speaker A:And I also wanted to make it, too, because of the amazing work that you do with the Pats on the foundation.
Speaker A:If you are somebody out there today who's struggling with Alzheimer's, knows a family member that is.
Speaker A:We will have contact information for Morgan in the show notes.
Speaker A:Please get in touch with her.
Speaker A:I know that the foundation has a ton of resources, articles, things that can help you.
Speaker A:And so if you're going through that, maybe you thought you were just coming to hear Morgan, but maybe you heard about something else.
Speaker A:Get in contact.
Speaker A:If there's topics, too, that you'd like to hear about in the future, please let me know.
Speaker A:We're always looking for new guests, new topics.
Speaker A:But Morgan Vance, thank you for being a guest of my One Big Thing podcast.
Speaker B:Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker B:Steve.
Speaker B:Feels great to see you.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:Thanks for checking out my show.
Speaker A:If you enjoyed this episode, I'd love for you to write a review or drop a comment wherever you're listening or watching.
Speaker A:And be sure to stay connected.
Speaker A:Did you know you can subscribe to my YouTube channel, which is EveCampbellPR?
Speaker A:That's Steve Campbell PR and I'm a real person who's reachable.
Speaker A:You can find me on all my socials and connect with me.
Speaker A:If you have topics or guests you'd love to hear from, let me know.
Speaker A:But thanks for being a part of of this journey with me.
Speaker A:And until next time, enjoy other episodes of the One Big Thing podcast.
