Episode 48
You Are Not Alone - Navigating Infertility with Lisa Connally
Many of us dream of having children one day, but for some, the journey to parenthood comes with unexpected challenges. Infertility is a silent struggle that deserves more attention, and in this episode, we’re diving deep into the emotional and physical toll it takes.
My good friend, Lisa Connally, bravely shares her story—her desire to start a family, the ups and downs of IVF, and the invaluable lessons she’s learned along the way. And let’s give her some love because this is her first-ever podcast appearance!
We talk about the rollercoaster of emotions that comes with fertility struggles, the power of open communication in relationships, and the importance of finding support—whether through friends, family, or online communities. Lisa’s honesty and insight make this conversation one you won’t want to miss.
Tune in for a heartfelt discussion that brings awareness, understanding, and hope to those on a similar path.
Takeaways:
- Infertility can feel isolating, but remember, you're definitely not alone in this journey.
- Navigating infertility often requires tough conversations that can strengthen your relationship with your partner.
- Finding support, whether from friends or through online communities, can make a huge difference during tough times.
- It's crucial to communicate openly with family about your struggles, while also setting boundaries for your emotional well-being.
- Finding humor and positivity in the midst of challenges, like following relatable social media accounts, can help lighten the emotional load.
- Engaging in self-care activities, such as working out or coloring, can help manage stress and provide a healthy outlet for emotions.
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About Lisa:
Lisa is a Senior Processor at Lawyers Land & Title and has worked in the title industry for nine years. Her kindness, ability to work under stressful situations, and continuous positive attitude are only a few of the reasons why LLT is lucky to have her. Many clients have acknowledged Lisa’s attention to time management and her constant communication. Lisa is originally from upstate New York, but has lived in Tennessee for the last ten years. She and her husband, Blake, have two puppies and love to golf when they have a free day together.
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Transcript
Welcome to the One Big Thing podcast, where inspiration meets transformation.
Speaker A:I'm your host, Steve Campbell, and I'm excited to have you join me today.
Speaker A:I welcome guests from all walks of life to the show.
Speaker A:We're going to spend about 30 minutes getting into their story and sharing the One Big Thing that they want to share with all of you that can help you move the forward in your life.
Speaker A:So thank you for being my guest in the One Big Thing and enjoy this episode.
Speaker B:This is the first time I've probably told or anyone who's listening in a while about this.
Speaker B:I think after our last miscarriage, I just took a break.
Speaker B:I mentally shut down as far as that aspect of this process, and that is because it hurt to think about it.
Speaker B:So today, been a little rough because I haven't thought about it in a while.
Speaker C:Welcome to the One Big Thing podcast.
Speaker C:I am your host, Steve Campbell.
Speaker C:Buckle up.
Speaker C:This one may get a little emotional.
Speaker C:Today is I am welcoming Lisa Connelly, who I knew as Lisa Croyle from back in the day meeting in high school.
Speaker C:Lisa and I have been lifelong friends.
Speaker C:She has been a major part of my wife Stephanie and I's life, and she is somebody that, as Steph and I were thinking about, who could I have on the show that we think has a story to tell that could inspire, could encourage, or just be extremely honest and raw about things they've gone through?
Speaker C:The One Big Thing is all about helping people in their 30s and 40s that are going through challenging or stretching seasons, hear from other human beings that are also going through things so that through their story, you may hopefully be able to move the ball forward or just be able to listen to a conversation between, in this case, two friends that have known each other for a long time.
Speaker C:And, you know, I've been honored to have, you know, almost 50 episodes and strangers that I'd never met that I've looked up to, musicians and athletes and people that first time I'm hopping on and recording an episode, it's really the first time I'm actually truly talking with them.
Speaker C:And it takes a little bit to get to know them, even through the first few minutes of a podcast.
Speaker C:But when it's somebody that you have known and done life with since you were 16, 17 years old, it just hits a little bit different.
Speaker C:There's more history there.
Speaker C:And Lisa was brave enough to come on her very first podcast to help tell her story.
Speaker C:And I want to tear up here at the beginning because she is brave.
Speaker C:You know, when I think about what topics are near and dear to my heart.
Speaker C:One of them that has always hit me at my core is those that have gone through a journey of infertility.
Speaker C:And I've mentioned it several times on this show before, as my oldest brother and his wife for 11 years struggled with infertility and went through IVF.
Speaker C:And, you know, it's very easy to have a podcast where everything is sunshine and rainbows and everybody's successful and you just gotta outwork everybody.
Speaker C:But then there's the reality of sometimes life doesn't make sense.
Speaker C: have gone through years, from: Speaker C:And I said, lisa, would you ever be brave enough to come on the podcast and talk?
Speaker C:And you share as much as you want to about what this experience has been like, not only as a woman, but as a wife trying to also have a career at the same time.
Speaker C:And so you have your professional, your personal life.
Speaker C:Would you be willing to come on to talk about what you've gone through?
Speaker C:Because your story will resonate with other people that maybe feel like nobody sees them or has gone through it.
Speaker C:And so, Lisa, welcome to the One Big Thing podcast.
Speaker C:I love you as a friend.
Speaker C:I am excited to have you here.
Speaker C:Why don't you tell people here right at the beginning, you and I had kind of talked about it.
Speaker C:If you had one big thing to share with individuals, especially around this world of going through infertility, what would you say to somebody listening out there today?
Speaker B:Biggest thing is that you're not alone.
Speaker B:There's a lot of people out there that are going through it and that it's gonna be okay.
Speaker B:It really is.
Speaker B:Struggle is hard.
Speaker B:I'm already getting emotional, but it's okay.
Speaker B:That's what I'd have to say.
Speaker C:Lace, you are amazing and so brave to be able to talk about things that when you're in your 30s and 40s, we don't talk about.
Speaker C:And even when I was talking with Steph last night leading up to the show, as I said, I have.
Speaker C:I know you're a nervous wreck because it's your story.
Speaker C:I'm a nervous wreck because I just don't want to get in the way.
Speaker C:I want to be gracious with you and help bring out what needs to be said in this conversation for the person that you just said feels alone, for the couple that feels forgotten, for the questions that people have tried to answer from years, from family and friends that they don't even know the answers to.
Speaker C:And so even as I've been doing the one big thing, and I have people at ball fields or basketball courts or just church, you know, friends, and they talk to me about the show.
Speaker C:And you interviewed this person, and I've brought up this idea of infertility.
Speaker C:I cannot tell you how many people perk up and go, yeah, we've struggled.
Speaker C:We've gone through it.
Speaker C:And all of a sudden you're like, whoa.
Speaker C:How many people have actually struggled with infertility?
Speaker C:You know, some have been able to have children.
Speaker C:Some are still, you know, waiting and hoping and believing.
Speaker C:But just being in the season.
Speaker C:When you say you're not alone, like, talk to me about in this experience, what this has been like for you.
Speaker C:You know, you are balancing.
Speaker C:Why don't you tell us?
Speaker C:Let's start with the easy things, Lisa.
Speaker C:Let's get it right.
Speaker C:Where do you.
Speaker C:Where do you live?
Speaker C:What do you do for a living?
Speaker C:And kind of.
Speaker C:How.
Speaker C:How has that part of your life been sh.
Speaker C:Up to this?
Speaker B:Yeah, so I'm actually 36.
Speaker B:I'll be 37 in, like, two weeks.
Speaker B:So I'm in that 30 to 40 age range like you were talking about.
Speaker B:I live in Murfreesboro, Tennessee.
Speaker B:I was originally from New York, though, as you know, since everyone knows that we're friends.
Speaker B:And I am a senior processor at Lawyers Land and Title.
Speaker B:So what I do is title insurance.
Speaker B:So when you buy your home, we are the people who take care of all of that for you.
Speaker B:We get you the title insurance and handle your closings, closing costs, all that stuff.
Speaker B:We do the title searches and stuff.
Speaker B:So that is our.
Speaker B:That's my biggest thing that I do.
Speaker B:I work there all the time Monday through Friday, so.
Speaker B:And sometimes not.
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker C:It's crazy, Lisa.
Speaker C:I remember, I think, waiting on you and your mom at the Olive Garden back in the day when you guys used to order seafood Portofino and would hang out.
Speaker C:And so when you're 18 years old, your whole life is in front of you.
Speaker C:You have dreams, you have aspirations, you have hopes and desires, and then you blink, and you're in your late 30s in.
Speaker C:Life doesn't always make sense.
Speaker C:Life doesn't always add up.
Speaker C:Life.
Speaker C:I don't know if in your current career, now, this is what you envisioned since you were a little girl, but.
Speaker C:But, you know, it's.
Speaker C:It's what you have the capacity to do.
Speaker C:And so, you know, you and I haven't been together in years, but just watching you from afar, you've been successful in your role there.
Speaker C:I mean, what is that?
Speaker C:And if you're some of Lisa's dogs in the background, folks, just realize, this is a real podcast.
Speaker C:We're not going to edit them out.
Speaker C:This is real life.
Speaker C:Lisa was able to, you know, be brave enough to do this from her own home today.
Speaker C:You know, when you say you're, you're not alone.
Speaker C:Just touching on the infertility, I, I was looking at some statistics kind of leading up to the show in just how widespread it actually is.
Speaker C:And just generationally, it felt like, at least in our world, we never had adults that were older than us talk about these kind of things.
Speaker C:And so when you're in your 30s, navigating something as big and impactful as infertility, I'm sure even in your world with your husband, there has been senses of loneliness.
Speaker C:So has there been anything just in your journey that giving you the space here right at the beginning you want to talk about or share that you think might be able to help somebody out there listening?
Speaker B:Well, you know, as you talked about, once you started telling people that you were going to do this, it's just the amount of people that start to perk up and you never knew that they were going through it.
Speaker B:That's what I mean by, you know, you're not alone.
Speaker B:Like, there are so many people that just don't want to talk about this situation of infertility because you don't want people to know this personal part of your life.
Speaker B:Essentially, that's the behind closed doors that people don't see.
Speaker B:And I feel like in that aspect, that's what I mean by you're not alone.
Speaker B:Because there are so many people going through it.
Speaker B:And I want to be a voice that can talk to people and hope that they understand that.
Speaker B:And if they need someone to talk to that's going through it, they can reach out a message or anything along those lines.
Speaker B:You know, when I was going through it and I found out that I had a friend that was actually going through it at the same time, that's what we did.
Speaker B:Reached out to one another, started talking experiences, things that you're going through, but you don't want to talk to people just randomly on the street and tell them that you're going through it.
Speaker B:So it's a little hard when it comes to that situation.
Speaker C: d your husband had tried from: Speaker C:That's five years.
Speaker C:That's a lot of conversations.
Speaker C:It's a lot of Interactions with co workers and friends and old high school friends and catching up with them and, you know, the inevitably, what are you up to these days?
Speaker C:How's the family?
Speaker C:And you have to talk about things.
Speaker C:How has that been for you?
Speaker C:How has it come up in conversation?
Speaker C:I mean, how do you navigate?
Speaker C:It's not.
Speaker C:It does not define you, but it is such a major part of your life.
Speaker C:How do you find space and grace to weave that in?
Speaker C:And has there been anything that's helped you as you've interacted with new people to share that?
Speaker C:Hey, guys, this is a big part of my story.
Speaker C:Like, how does that evolve for you?
Speaker B:You know, what's funny is sometimes it just randomly comes up in a convo.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:My husband and I, obviously five years, so we have our bond and our connection that we have over a period of time has brought us closer and to the couple we are now, I mean, it actually grew our relationship.
Speaker B:Where I know some people, it actually hurts their relationship.
Speaker B:And unfortunately, I hate that for people because this is such an intimate thing between you as husband and wife that it's.
Speaker B:Communication is key during this whole thing.
Speaker B:That's a huge part now as friends, bringing it up to them.
Speaker B:You know, I feel like you have always those close group of friends that you're with and that you can kind of rely on and you kind of like almost on a.
Speaker B:Not poke the bear, but kind of bring up a little bit in conversation and just be like, you know, hey, we're going through this and kind of see how they react to your thing.
Speaker B:And then based upon that reaction, I feel like is how you feel you can continue on the conversation a little bit more in depth with them and finding a, you know, a person in them that you can rely on to talk to.
Speaker B:As far as strangers go, some word of mouth happens and it happens to come up in a conversation.
Speaker B:Prime example.
Speaker B:We were out one night with a group of friends, and my husband has a fire buddy that he works with, and they were going through something and they happened to be there and she just leaned over and she was like, I heard y'all have been going through it too.
Speaker B:Can you have words of wisdom?
Speaker B:So it's like, it's just.
Speaker B:Sometimes it just randomly happens and it's gotten really easier to be at that point now that I'm okay with helping people and talking to them about it openly.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But yeah, it's.
Speaker B:It's just like randomness.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker B:I don't really know how to explain it.
Speaker B:It's more like trying to weave through it, you know, trying to figure out who you can talk to, who you can't talk to, and who wants to talk to you about it.
Speaker C:Well, and you know, I think we're at the stage in our life where there's like, you know, when we were growing up, Lis, you and I grew up in the Microsoft chat rooms of aol, where you would start every conversation with asl, which if you know what that means, why don't you go ahead and put in the chat ASL folks, for those of you that don't know, this is how you used to say, what is your age?
Speaker C:What is your sex?
Speaker C:And then where do you live?
Speaker C:And so when you would connect with people online, you'd be like, oh, 16, male, Florida, you know, and people would be like, it sounds hot, let's chat.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:But now, now that you and I are in our 30s, you know, it's like, hey, great meeting you.
Speaker C:Like, what do you do for a living?
Speaker C:You know, so we have these like questions that people ask at this stage of life, which is pretty commonplace in most cultural circles, regardless of where you live, like, what do you do for a living?
Speaker C:You know, another one may be, are you married, you have a significant other, and then kids.
Speaker C:So like, how do you even navigate, like, how do you navigate that?
Speaker C:This has been a difficult road for you and your husband and there are well meaning people that this is like an area, a topic that we walk on eggshells around because of the sensitivity to it, that we can botch it, or like, so do you have kids?
Speaker C:And it's like, no.
Speaker C:And then like, even you're just like, oh, okay, oh gosh, I'm sorry.
Speaker C:Like, how, how do you, how would you even encourage, you know, your journey, journey through infertility is so personal to your life.
Speaker C:But what if there are people out there that are, are married, you know, and a spouse, and they're, they're navigating this or even a friendship, you know, I think it's hard even too when you have somebody who, if you've never walked in their shoes to, to really fully have deep empathy for what they've gone through.
Speaker C:There's a certain area that you can't go past any further other than that must be hard.
Speaker C:How would you even speak to somebody who knows somebody going through infertility?
Speaker C:How do you support them?
Speaker C:What does that look like?
Speaker C:What has been the most meaningful support to you over these last five years?
Speaker C:Your husband or outside, from friends or co workers.
Speaker B:So biggest support is my Husband.
Speaker B:I mean that.
Speaker B: So in: Speaker B:I don't know if anyone's familiar with it, but it's called iui, which is basically best way to explain it.
Speaker B:Turkey baster.
Speaker B:It basically is an easier way to help the sperm get up to the egg.
Speaker B:So it basically bypasses all the work that they usually have to do.
Speaker B:So we did that for the first two years, and after that, it was hard on our relationship.
Speaker B:It actually became more like roommates instead of husband and wife.
Speaker B:And it.
Speaker B:And I know if anyone is going through that, they understand what I'm talking about because it's such a strenuous situation.
Speaker B:You have to have sex at a certain time, you have to have this certain pill at a certain time, take a shot at a certain time.
Speaker B:So it becomes hard.
Speaker B:So after that, we took a break for a year.
Speaker B:So I say five years, but we took a break, and then we went through the ivf.
Speaker B:Once you start the IVF again, shots, pills, all these things that you have to do.
Speaker B:But during this, communication started to come in between me and my husband and talking about the hardness, talking about the rough road, talking about, you know, we had four embryos talking about that.
Speaker B:We have.
Speaker B:This is our shop.
Speaker B:We have these.
Speaker B:That was probably the hardest part, is once you start this process and you go, you know, one miscarriage after another after another, you get to that last one, and you're.
Speaker B:You and him have to have that hard conversation of, this is it, or do we try again?
Speaker B:You know, and throughout this whole process, it's a mental thing for the woman.
Speaker B:I mean, not saying it's not for the man, for the husband either, you know, and bless them for dealing with us when we go through all that, because it's a lot.
Speaker B:Your hormones are changing, all the things are happening, but the constant communication, the love, the affection that you get once you start going through such an intimate thing together is really what brings.
Speaker B:Brought us together, in all honesty.
Speaker B:So where we were fighting and upset and angry in the beginning, during that iui, it ended up turning around into a beautiful thing where I know it was a hard struggle and, you know, so sad what we went through, but I also got a great thing out of it and a stronger marriage.
Speaker B:And I hope that other people out there can resonate with communicating like that.
Speaker B:Now, as far as friends go and talking with them.
Speaker B:Oh, I had so much support.
Speaker B:It is crazy, like.
Speaker B:And the support that I got from people was just praying for you.
Speaker B:Prayers.
Speaker B:How's.
Speaker B:How are you doing your Update, you know, how are things going?
Speaker B:What's new?
Speaker B:What's the next step?
Speaker B:What can we do to help things along those lines?
Speaker B:Like, so it is anyone that knows anyone that's going through it.
Speaker B:Constant positivity is what is exactly needs to be resonated towards people.
Speaker B:That's my biggest thing to say.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:In marriage, in and of itself is hard enough.
Speaker C:You're bringing together two people that were created at different times with different upbringings and different, you know, experiences, and bringing them together and saying for better or worse on your wedding day.
Speaker C:And you don't always know what the better is.
Speaker C:You don't always know what the worse is when you make those vows.
Speaker C:And then you get into situations like this.
Speaker C:And so if you add the infertility in there, I can only imagine how hard it must have been for you and your husband to talk through something that doesn't really make a lot of sense.
Speaker C:And so I'm thinking about those listeners out there that are in that position that you had talked about where maybe it was optimism at the beginning, but now they've reached that hard part of the relationship.
Speaker C:I'm not saying that they're accusing or blaming one another, but it's crazy what the human mind can do.
Speaker C:When you experience pain, you try to find the fastest way to comfort yourself.
Speaker C:And I, I, I would assume it'd be easy to say if Lisa, or if just your husband would be this way, then you already have expectations of what your spouse should be.
Speaker C:How would you encourage or what steps did you and your husband take to acknowledge?
Speaker C:Like, this is hard.
Speaker C:Was this a one time conversation?
Speaker C:Was this a series of conversations?
Speaker C:Was it time in place?
Speaker C:Like, how did you guys go from the optimism to the time off to actually becoming stronger?
Speaker C:What are the things that you guys implemented that could encourage somebody who's like, I just feel like we're roommates.
Speaker C:This is, this is awful.
Speaker C:How do we get past what we're feeling?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, you know, like you said, it's so exciting in the beginning.
Speaker B:And then you got to that point where again, like I said, it was roommates hard conversation had to happen.
Speaker B:You know, it was honestly, I was making dinner one night and I looked at him on the couch and I was like, we have got to talk.
Speaker B:Like, we both are feeling a certain way, obviously, and it's not being vocalized.
Speaker B:We're both trying to walk on eggshells because we want things, you know, to work out and to be the best thing, but we need to talk.
Speaker B:And we both sat down and had an honest, heart to heart conversation and talked about the things we didn't want to talk about, which was scared to death that he couldn't give a baby, that he couldn't make one.
Speaker B:I'm scared to death that I can't make one.
Speaker B:You know, those are the tough conversations that you have to have with one another.
Speaker B:And it sucked so much.
Speaker B:But at the same time, once we had that convo, it was like a weight was lifted off the shoulder that we both actually were able to express.
Speaker B:Express how we both feel.
Speaker B:We both want a family, obviously.
Speaker B:That's why we're both trying to do all of this.
Speaker B:So that part was the hardest part.
Speaker B:And then throughout the process, it was just little sit downs, you know, before we'd go in for a procedure, before we'd have the embryo implanted, you know, we would sit down and have the conversation.
Speaker B:Okay, here we are.
Speaker B:What do we expect?
Speaker B:Don't expect anything crazy.
Speaker B:Let's just go through the motion.
Speaker B:We're praying for the best thing to happen.
Speaker B:And we just.
Speaker B:That's how we were.
Speaker B:We just had little conversations here and there, you know, on the couch.
Speaker B:I mean, it could just be a random Tuesday.
Speaker B:We'd be watching a show and I'd pause it and I'd be like, can we have a conversation?
Speaker B:Like, I got something on my mind and vice versa.
Speaker B:He would do the same thing, which made him start talking to me more, which made me start being like, okay, well, if he's talking, then I should be talking.
Speaker B:Which I felt, you know, it just made us start bonding over something so hurtful.
Speaker B:But it made our bond and marriage stronger, had more love, appreciation for one another, understanding that even though I'm going through something, he is too.
Speaker B:You know, it's not.
Speaker B:I'm not the only one that's losing the baby.
Speaker B:He's losing the baby, too.
Speaker B:It may not be him going through everything that I'm going through, but he's still a part of me and he's still a part of this whole situation.
Speaker B:So that is something that I, again, only biggest thing I can tell people is communication.
Speaker B:I know it's hard.
Speaker B:It's the worst thing you want to have conversation about.
Speaker B:But getting real with your husband or wife is a good thing.
Speaker B:It is a good thing, and I feel like people should do it well.
Speaker C:And you had led off with, you know, reminder, you're not alone.
Speaker C:So I will continually remind you, listening to this episode, if you are going through infertility, you are not alone.
Speaker C:Lisa, there's like Three areas in my mind that I am circling around, and I.
Speaker C:If we can hit on all three, that'd be great.
Speaker C:I think just getting started.
Speaker C: I want to talk about in: Speaker C:What resources exist?
Speaker C:I'd like to talk about just community, right?
Speaker C:You've talked about, you know, you and your husband, you guys are together, but then like, the community, the people you're meeting, like, where do you go outside of your home to talk with people?
Speaker C:But then also just like, family dynamics, you know, family dynamics.
Speaker C:That could be great, could be awful.
Speaker C:People don't understand, you know, So I think maybe just a good point, we can get to community and family after.
Speaker C:But when you.
Speaker C: ,: Speaker C:And if so, what?
Speaker C:Like, how did you start to even sense something might be going on?
Speaker C:And then where do you even go when you go through something like this to get resources?
Speaker C:Is it just Google?
Speaker C:Is it communities?
Speaker C: started like for you back in: Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So my husband and I have been married for seven years, going on eight.
Speaker B: So: Speaker B:We had been trying, not preventing it, but we were actively trying, and it just wasn't happening.
Speaker B:You know, it was every month, everything would happen.
Speaker B:And got to a point where we had a conversation, and I said, hey, I feel like we need to go get some tests done.
Speaker B:And he obviously said, I'm fine, and didn't want to do it.
Speaker B:But then after a little bit of talking and conversation, he's like, okay, well, let's.
Speaker B:Let's just go see.
Speaker B:So we both agreed.
Speaker B:So he went and got his sperm tested, and I had all of my inside looked at everything.
Speaker B:And what happened is I went to my gynecologist first.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:And she had talked about, you need to go try Nashville Fertility.
Speaker B:That's who handles all that.
Speaker B:Call them, make an appointment.
Speaker B:So we called, made an appointment, and then that's when they suggested the testing, the sperm count and checking inside.
Speaker B:So we did that, and after that, we came back that everything was okay, that we didn't have any issues.
Speaker B:My husband had a little bit of a low motility, but everything else was fine.
Speaker B:So they just weren't swimming as fast as the best way to explain it.
Speaker B:So everything else was great, though.
Speaker B:Count.
Speaker B:I was good, all of that.
Speaker B:So she's like, it's easy.
Speaker B:It'll be Fine.
Speaker B:So we're like, okay.
Speaker B:So started the IUI process, and then it just went from there.
Speaker B:So after iui, we did three rounds of the iui.
Speaker B:After that, we were able to do a fourth if we wanted to or not.
Speaker B:And that's when we said no, because that's when we had the conversation, and we both agreed that it was time for a break.
Speaker B:Then after that, we decided, hey, we have an option here still of ivf.
Speaker B:It's expensive.
Speaker B:And anyone that's going through it, I understand 100% that it's expensive.
Speaker B:I don't know why insurance does not cover it, but it does not.
Speaker B:And after that, we saw the same doctors again at National Fertility, and they started that IVF process where they retrieved our eggs, mama eggs, retrieved his sperm.
Speaker B:They put them together, got four embryos out of it.
Speaker B:We froze them, and then started the process of going through the transfers.
Speaker B:And we had four transfers.
Speaker C:Well, and for those that are early onset stages, realizing.
Speaker C:Talk to a doctor, something might be going on.
Speaker C:I know you talked about IVF and the lack of insurance coverage.
Speaker C:Do you even.
Speaker C:Do you even have a ballpark idea for somebody who's never gone through something like this, what one treatment, let alone 4 of IVF, would.
Speaker C:Would cost?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So the first beginning is always the most expensive part, because they have to do the egg retrieval, make the embryos, and freeze them or anything along those.
Speaker B:So it cost us around 25,000 for the beginning.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then each transfer after that, you're just paying for the transfer, if that makes sense.
Speaker B:So you don't have to retrieve the eggs again because you already have them, but you have to pay for them to be thawed out and for them to put them in and the doctor's visits and all of that and all.
Speaker B:No, we probably spend around 60,000 plus on everything now.
Speaker B:And that's.
Speaker B:Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker C:Is there special.
Speaker C:You know, sometimes if you go and you have surgery, they have certain lines of, you know, financing through things like that to help offset the cost, since it's not covered by insurance.
Speaker C:Was there anything presented to you guys?
Speaker C:Because $60,000 is not a small bill.
Speaker C:And so on one end, you have the desire to have a child, which is more invaluable than everything.
Speaker C:But the reality is also then taking on the cost of $60,000 isn't a small investment.
Speaker C:So as you go through this process, was it for you guys just figuring out, like, how do we get together as much cash?
Speaker C:Did you, like, what.
Speaker C:What process would somebody take if they want to explore this, yeah.
Speaker B:So we had some money in savings saved up.
Speaker B:We had been saving it up and we calculated numbers and tried to justify what we could and what we couldn't do and we basically just paid out of pocket every time we went.
Speaker B:Now you could go for a visit and get a bill later on instead of paying up front.
Speaker B:But for the most part everything is an upfront thing.
Speaker B:They do not take a payment plan, they do not do that.
Speaker B:At least they did it for us.
Speaker B:So I don't know.
Speaker B:Now I know that there are like, if you had worked for Amazon, they have insurance and they cover that.
Speaker B:So some companies have that on there, but not, I mean, I think it was only two and Amazon's the only one.
Speaker B:I remember because I was thinking about getting a part time job at one point just so I could go and get the insurance or get a job there just so I could get insurance.
Speaker B:So yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker B:That thought went through my head and I told Blake and he said no, which Blake's my husband.
Speaker B:I don't know if I said his name.
Speaker B:So sorry.
Speaker C:Blake, we love you, man.
Speaker C:I had another conversation with Carl Urban who went through many years of depression and he and I just ugly cried while we recorded because that is something that if you've never gone through depression, it's just devastating.
Speaker C:And so as you're just talking, I just in the back of my head just thinking of you and Blake and you guys are incredible.
Speaker C:I'm obviously sorry for everything that you've experienced in this process, but you are helping people that are feeling alone.
Speaker C:And so for you it's got to be hard too when you have a doctor or an authority figure say all the vitals, all the signs are good.
Speaker C:And then it's almost like this, well, then we're going to be okay.
Speaker C:And this is going to happen because you've told us like we're okay.
Speaker C:And so then the reality of five years later, it's still not what you had originally sent out to do.
Speaker C:Talk to us then about community.
Speaker C:Where do you go?
Speaker C:And I'm not talking about like, you know, you're at cocktails one night and it comes up, have you been, have you joined any like social platforms?
Speaker C:Are there communities that exist?
Speaker C:Do the hospitals or the doctor's offices have like support groups you can go to?
Speaker C:What does that look like for somebody who might feel alone talking to their, talking to their spouse, but now says, I need somebody outside my house?
Speaker C:Like what exists for somebody going through infertility?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So there, whenever you go to your doctor, there is a little sign that they always have up in every room that says, you know, if you are struggling or need help, they have meetings that you can go to.
Speaker B:There's an online portal that you can go to.
Speaker B:I personally did not go to any of that.
Speaker B:But they do have things to help you out with the grieving process and things to help navigate you through it.
Speaker B:This is gonna, I don't want to say sound morbid, but I started following a girl on Instagram called Hilarious Infertile, which is related to infertility, and she posts memes and funny things to try to help you go through the process to make you not feel sad about what you're going through.
Speaker B:That actually helped because it made me try not to feel sad and to try to get into be a better positive attitude towards what we were going through.
Speaker B:So that helped me.
Speaker B:But besides my husband, I didn't really go out in the community to talk with anyone.
Speaker B:Not a part of my family or friends.
Speaker B:And my husband, that's who I relied on a lot through this process.
Speaker B:Now, I'm not saying that there are not things out there, but I don't know every platform as far as that goes, but anyone can Google, you know, infertility, grief counseling or things along those lines, and Google will pop, pop up a bunch of stuff.
Speaker B:I actually did it a couple times, but I then went back to friends who I had gotten close with or a family member and started talking with them.
Speaker B:So community, though, again, I guess my community was my friend's family and husband.
Speaker B:So, yeah.
Speaker C:And leading, leading up to the show, I did see that there was some, you know, fairly large Facebook private groups that exist for those ladies that are going through infertility.
Speaker C:You talked about family, right?
Speaker C:Let's.
Speaker C:If, if this is an okay time topic to talk about.
Speaker C:If it's not, we will move on.
Speaker C:When you have family, your family has expectations, your parents have expectations, your siblings, everyone in the way that that is sometimes delivered can be full of grace or just blunt trauma.
Speaker C:And so what is that experience been like for you as a daughter, as a wife, talking about family, what is it that you know, has surprised you or just.
Speaker C:Just talk about the experience dealing with family, going through this.
Speaker B:Family, hard family, as much as they love you and want to support you and do all the things, it's hard because you're always getting asked when, in the beginning, when you're married, anyone who's out there right now, it's when the kids coming like you were talking about, you know, you're married.
Speaker B:How many kids do you have?
Speaker B:When are the kids coming?
Speaker B:And we're trying, you know, you keep talking about.
Speaker B:And then it comes to a point where it's like, please stop asking.
Speaker B:Like, if we want you to know anything, we'll tell you things.
Speaker B:And then once you start this process, it's like, okay, family is close.
Speaker B:We need to talk to family.
Speaker B:I only told, I did tell everyone, which I would like to point out too.
Speaker B:Everyone that's not alone going through this.
Speaker B:I came from a big family.
Speaker B:I have four brothers and two sisters, and every single one of them have a kid.
Speaker B:I am the only one that does not.
Speaker B:We are not.
Speaker B:We don't have children.
Speaker B:So growing up like that, you expect that if everyone else in your family is having kids, then you should be able to have kids.
Speaker B:So I want people out there to know that you're not alone in that.
Speaker B:If you're growing up where all of your family is having children and you're not, it's okay.
Speaker B:It really is okay.
Speaker B:So once that process of you going through that and having to tell a family member that, hey, this is what's going on, then it becomes, when's your appointment?
Speaker B:When can I be there?
Speaker B:Can I help you?
Speaker B:Can I do all this?
Speaker B:And the love and support is great, but it comes to a point where it's like, if I'm not telling you anything, then please respect that boundary and I will tell you the things that I want to tell you.
Speaker B:I talked with my mother and my mother in law a lot throughout that process and explaining the things that we were going through.
Speaker B:But it got to a point where I actually stopped talking to them because I was tired of all the questions and the things that kept coming and can I come with you?
Speaker B:And it's pretty intimate thing that I just would like to have with my husband.
Speaker B:So don't really want to visit her there, unfortunately.
Speaker B:But I just wanted it to be us going through that experience.
Speaker B:And so family's hard.
Speaker B:That's the best way to say it.
Speaker C:Family's hard, Lisa, irrespective of talking about infertility, family is hard just in general.
Speaker C:And I think there is, I think there is also, as you grow up, you mature, you grow, you have life experiences that family hits you in an even greater way because you have more worldly wisdom and you've gone through things and you have these, these kind of crisis moments, you know, with your parents, your in laws, whoever of.
Speaker C:Because you now, you know, are going through things yourself of like, man, were my parents Always that way.
Speaker C:Like, you know, dynamics that, you know, in the 90s, I mean, we grew up going to restaurants that kids will never understand about.
Speaker C:You know, when a hostess would ask you smoking or non smoking, that would be such a foreign concept to any young student today out there, that there was a restaurants where half of the place was filled with smoke and half was not.
Speaker C:And there was a meme I'd saw one time of a girl that was like, your kids today will never know what it was like getting your book from school as an award, going to Pizza Hut and having smoke over your head.
Speaker C:And those things always get me because I'm like, those are the glory days.
Speaker C:But I think, I think then as you grow up and you have a career of your own and you're navigating, right, there are people that are, well meaning that want to be a part of it.
Speaker C:But then you also just acknowledge that this journey is for you and Blake.
Speaker C:And I think, you know, whether it's infertility, whether it's just, you know, parenting, whatever it is, you have your own ways, when you're married with your spouse of like, this is how we're going to do things.
Speaker C:And that can be upsetting to parents and grandparents that don't understand.
Speaker C:How has that dynamic been for you with siblings having children in just the reality that, you know, the kids are in front?
Speaker C:Like, how have you and Blake worked through that?
Speaker C:Have there been barriers or, like, things that you've had to protect yourself from?
Speaker C:Or like, how do you work through the emotions of wanting to be there for your siblings and their families and celebrate with them while also, like, realizing that it is hard?
Speaker C:Like, what is that like for you.
Speaker B:Kind of walking through that journey so hard, especially.
Speaker B:Say again?
Speaker B:My brothers and sisters are a lot older than I am, so my nieces and nephews are pretty grown right now too.
Speaker B:So I don't have to go through the baby experience right now, if that makes sense.
Speaker B:So all the kids and siblings, my nieces and nephews, were all born before we started going through this process.
Speaker B:So they were already growing up.
Speaker B:And at an age where it was fun, you know, you have to play with them when they're toddlers or, you know, now there's teenagers driving and going to college.
Speaker B:So navigating through that is just being an aunt, you know, I.
Speaker B:I don't think anything of that, I guess, because it's family, so I don't have a hard time with that part.
Speaker B:Now you're talking about that.
Speaker B:We can talk about some friends that I have.
Speaker B:We had a couple very close to us who got pregnant while we were going through the infertility.
Speaker B:That was hard.
Speaker B:I was green with envy, but also at the same time, so happy for them as a couple.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And I think the hardest part about all that is people who are going through what I've gone through are going through it right now.
Speaker B:If anyone out there is a family member or friend and they get pregnant, don't be scared to tell someone who's going through ivf.
Speaker B:I feel like that makes it hurt harder for us.
Speaker B:You know, my friend that I'm talking about, I was really close with, she was scared to tell me that she was pregnant.
Speaker B:And I get why, because it's such a sensitive topic.
Speaker B:And she and I had talked a lot.
Speaker B:We talk all the time about, you know, the things that we went through that I went through with this.
Speaker B:And she was so scared to tell me, and I was so sad.
Speaker B:It made me more sad that she was scared to tell me than how happy she should have been so we could celebrate, which we did end up celebrating.
Speaker B:And she has beautiful baby girl and a baby boy now.
Speaker B:So it's just one of those things where people who are going through it.
Speaker B:Don't exclude us from your life choice.
Speaker B:You know, it's.
Speaker B:It's tough.
Speaker B:It's tough.
Speaker B:So as far as friends and I mean, as far as the family question, like I was saying, you know, they were already grown, so I didn't feel like I had to have a hard time with that.
Speaker B:You know, my brother, I mean, Blake has a brother, his two brothers and a sister, same thing.
Speaker B:The kids are all grown and all that, so we don't have to have to go through that baby experience with the family.
Speaker B:It was the friends that we had to go through with that.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Well, for those that are, you know, here, champion.
Speaker C:Lisa, first of all, thank you for coming on and showing her some love and support.
Speaker C:You know, if you're an Apple user, you can always leave a rating and review.
Speaker C:Leave a review about this episode in particular.
Speaker C:And the reason I would say that most people discover podcasts and episodes when they go on an Apple or Spotify by keywords.
Speaker C:And so if anybody is going through a journey of infertility and they type that into a search bar.
Speaker C:If you leave a comment on this episode today about what you experience going in through Lisa, it will actually suggest this episode for a user.
Speaker C:So get on there, show her some love talk.
Speaker C:You know, leave a chat about what you experienced listening to her, because somebody else may Definitely needs to listen to this episode and they just need to be able to discover it.
Speaker C:And what you just said about with siblings I had mentioned I have two older brothers.
Speaker C:And you, you know, you've been best friends with Steph for a long time.
Speaker C:You know, we got four, four wild children.
Speaker C:And so I, I'm coming from a place of just an empathetic friend that has loved you and I want the best for you.
Speaker C:And so I wanted to give you space.
Speaker C:But there's also a barrier to what I can understand because I do have four children.
Speaker C:And I remember that when we had our second, my brother was right in the thick of going through infertility for years older than me.
Speaker C:And I remember clear as day, I was with Stephen.
Speaker C:So shout out to my, my, my wife's twin brother.
Speaker C:I remember I was with him might have been Thanksgiving.
Speaker C:We had known for a couple weeks that Stefan was pregnant.
Speaker C:And I remember walking into a bedroom and pulling out my phone and sitting there.
Speaker C:And as much as I was happy, I thought, lord, how do I call my brother?
Speaker C:And so I am very sympathetic to this because I remember when he picked up the phone, I remember the shame that I had of it's not fair.
Speaker C:And I remember he was excited for me, but in that moment he was like, okay.
Speaker C:And I think this topic is so impactful to me because I've never walked in your shoes.
Speaker C:I've never been where you've been.
Speaker C:I've never been to a doctor's office with you.
Speaker C:And there are so many people out there today that that phone call wrecked me because it was the happiest moment of my life.
Speaker C:It was a thing that you say a prayer up to heaven and you hope that Jesus hears you and you have a blessing and a miracle.
Speaker C:And then the people that you want to share it with the most, there's this separation between the two of us.
Speaker C:And I just remember that there was walking through that experience for Steph and I was challenging because on one end we wanted to be gracious to my brother and my sister in law Aaron and their situation, but at the same time, we wanted to scream from the mountaintops what was happening to us.
Speaker C:And so I just remember that phone call.
Speaker C:And even as I was listening to you, I was like, do I even share the story?
Speaker C:Do I even share the story?
Speaker C:Because it's real to me as to why this topic.
Speaker C:When I hear people go through infertility, my heart immediately joins them and I begin praying in secret, Lord, to help them, whatever that looks like.
Speaker C:And so you have been brave enough for 40 minutes to do your first ever bang up podcast, which Lisa, you are incredible and you are going to help help so many people.
Speaker C:And I hope that the one big thing was your launching platform to talk with other pot.
Speaker C:If you got a podcast out there and you need a guest, Lisa Connolly, she's your gal, man.
Speaker C:She's gonna come break down some walls and barriers.
Speaker C:But I always, in the time that we have, like to give people and you've done a little bit through the show, one or two takeaways and so I just, I don't want to put you on the spot.
Speaker C:Is there anything in this journey, going through this that has helped you the most?
Speaker C:Is it doing, getting your mind off of it?
Speaker C:Is it going to the gym?
Speaker C:Is it therapy?
Speaker C:Is it journaling?
Speaker C:Is it an app?
Speaker C:Like, what is it for you, Lisa Connelly, those one or two things that like has helped you the most kind of wrestle with what you're going through.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So probably the biggest thing is I have started working out again.
Speaker B:While going through that process.
Speaker B:It was tough to work out while taking shots and doing all the things.
Speaker B:So that has helped my mentality, keep my mental back.
Speaker B:And it also helps me take out frustration.
Speaker B:So any stress or anger that I start to build up helps out with.
Speaker B:That sounds silly, but I bought coloring books at one point, started coloring like a 2 year olds.
Speaker B:So channeling my inner kids, which I felt ironic being that we were going through that with a kid.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But that helped a lot and I started reading last year.
Speaker B:I read like a few books and those really helped.
Speaker B:I have been trying to read more again this year.
Speaker B:I branched off of that one summer in the holidays.
Speaker B:Not going to lie.
Speaker B:So that has helped.
Speaker B:But the biggest thing that I feel like is I really haven't talked about it much.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And that's being raw.
Speaker B:This is the first time I've probably told or anyone who's listening in a while about this.
Speaker B:I think after our last miscarriage I just took a break.
Speaker B:I mentally shut down as far as the that aspect of this process.
Speaker B:And that is because it hurt to think about it.
Speaker B:So today's been a little rough because I haven't thought about it in a while.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker C:You're good.
Speaker C:I told you when we started this job together today we're not going to manufacture a conversation.
Speaker C:What you just said is so powerful that you were willing to do that because of the countless people you're going to help.
Speaker C:So I just as the host of the show and as a friend I appreciate you being willing to talk about that in the coloring.
Speaker C:What a plot twist at the end.
Speaker B:I know, it's.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's the silliest thing, but I would get pencils, markers, and I'd sit on the couch, and I just color while Blake watched a show or he was playing his game on his phone.
Speaker B:You know, it's just something that we would do, and we would be together, and that's what I did.
Speaker B:I bought a puzzle, too.
Speaker B:It's still not put together, so there's just little things, you know, just trying to branch out and try new things.
Speaker B:And that's another thing.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:I know we're probably running out of time.
Speaker C:No, you keep going.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So out of all of this, I mentioned to you earlier about growth, strength, and appreciation that I feel like from this whole experience has helped growth.
Speaker B:I feel like I have matured more in five years than I've matured in 36.
Speaker B:The pressure you were under, the, you know, timeline, all this stuff that they put on people, it has made you, me, grow and realize that, you know, life is great.
Speaker B:It's okay.
Speaker B:It's okay to be going through what you're going through.
Speaker B:And that growth took a long time for me to say that strength.
Speaker B:Feel like I'm doing it right now.
Speaker B:Strength has been a lot, but I feel like through this whole process, I've become more vocal, independent.
Speaker B:I will talk about things if I have an issue now, whereas before, I used to hold back.
Speaker B:So that strength to push through those hard conversations or things, it's been wonderful.
Speaker B:And appreciation.
Speaker B:I appreciate my husband more than I ever have in my entire life, and I appreciate my friends and my family for being there through me, for me, not, you know, with me through this process.
Speaker B:And, yeah, that's three big things from this that I've taken and that I hope can help other people out there.
Speaker B:That it's okay.
Speaker B:I know you feel like you're at the end of your ropes, but it's okay.
Speaker B:It really is okay.
Speaker C:I appreciate you sharing those three things here at the end.
Speaker C:And there.
Speaker C:There is no time limit with conversations like this for you as a user listener.
Speaker C:If you stopped and started the car, hopefully you'll keep listening.
Speaker C:And I would encourage you that if you are walking through this journey, listen to this with your spouse.
Speaker C:Let Lisa's words resonate with you, that you are not alone and that there's strength and appreciation.
Speaker C:And strength.
Speaker C:Yeah, you can go pound some weights, but the strength that you've showed over the last 45 minutes is telling that I my experience as a host.
Speaker C:And here's what I'm going to challenge you with Lisa Connolly.
Speaker C:I've had the opportunity to interview people from all over life many times is not fair.
Speaker C:It doesn't make sense.
Speaker C:But it's those hard things in our life that can become the springboard that launches us to a season of connecting with people we never would have thought we would have ever met.
Speaker C:And my hope for you is that this will not be your only stop, whether it's a podcast or a speaking event, but that as much strength as you can muster, you will always use what you've gone through to connect with other people and to inspire and encourage them, because you're so beautiful inside and out.
Speaker C:And I just think of you and Blake and what you've gone through, and I wish I had answers to help you make sense of it, other than you're going to help a lot of people through this conversation today.
Speaker C:And I think you had mentioned it, so if I'm overstepping, I'll just delete it from after the podcast.
Speaker C:But you had mentioned if anybody has questions or thoughts to get in touch with you.
Speaker C:So we will make sure that in the Show Notes, which first time.
Speaker C:If you're ever podcasting, Show Notes are what goes under the title.
Speaker C:It's where you get a lot of the disclaimers and contact information.
Speaker C:We'll put Lisa's information in there.
Speaker C:If you're going through it, don't.
Speaker C:Don't feel like you're going through it alone, as she said.
Speaker C:Realize that, you know, statistically, as I talked about, so many people that are our age are going through this and may not have anybody to openly talk about.
Speaker C:And if this is your first step of acknowledging man, I didn't realize other people in situations like Lisa had talked about her going through it.
Speaker C:Let it become a place of strength for you in knowing that it's not your identity.
Speaker C:And don't be afraid like Lisa to.
Speaker C:To get outside your comfort zone and to talk about something that is hard.
Speaker C:Hard things are hard for a reason, but it's these.
Speaker C:I feel like I may be wrong.
Speaker C:Our generation is desperate for authenticity.
Speaker C:And I think we have had stuff in the media and on social media and on the news, just fire hydrant in front of us.
Speaker C:And I think we're all desperately in our late 30s, early 40s.
Speaker C:We want authentic.
Speaker C:And what you did today was authentic.
Speaker C:It was hard.
Speaker C:It was real.
Speaker C:It wasn't fabricated.
Speaker C:And so I just, I want to say thank you for coming on the One Big Thing and for being such a support to Steph and I over all these years.
Speaker C:We will.
Speaker C:To Lisa's family and friends, thank you for tuning in again.
Speaker C:If you'd be willing, we'd love for you to.
Speaker C:On YouTube or on any platform you listen, drop us a comment about this episode.
Speaker C:Share it with somebody that you know.
Speaker C:You think you could help them, because in the age of 20, 25, podcasts are one more platform that connects us all as human beings.
Speaker C:So as the host of the One Big Thing, thank all of you for being a listener of the show.
Speaker C:And Lisa, thank you for taking a chance and being a guest on the show.
Speaker B:Thank you for having me.
Speaker B:Steve, so good to see you.
Speaker B:Tell Stephanie I said hi.
Speaker C:Oh, I will.
Speaker C:We love you.
Speaker B:I love you.
Speaker C:How brave is is Lisa, by the way?
Speaker C:If you made it all the way through that episode, I appreciate you listening to the One Big Thing podcast.
Speaker C:What a heartfelt, deep, real and honest conversation with a beautiful woman and her husband in their 30s that wanted something that so many aspire to have, which is children and trying to make sense of, of a battle and a struggle that really doesn't make sense.
Speaker C:And so if you're out there today or you know somebody that has struggled with infertility, please remind them that they're not alone, as Lisa had talked about.
Speaker C:You know, don't make it a big thing.
Speaker C:Just love and support them.
Speaker C:Find out if you're, if you're asking too much, when to stop asking about how everything's going, because there's a real rawness to it that Lisa had spoke about.
Speaker C:But if you are somebody who is struggling with infertility and want somebody to talk to, Lisa has made herself available.
Speaker C:So don't forget in the show notes, I'll have information so you can get in contact with her.
Speaker C:But she was brave and strong to step out and share of something that is so real to her, that's real to so many people our age, and just know you're not alone.
Speaker C:So if you are here, champion Lisa, thank you for stopping by the One Big Thing.
Speaker C:Hope it's not your last stop.
Speaker C:Hope you'll check out some other guests.
Speaker C: unbelievable LineUp here for: Speaker C:If there's ever anybody you want to hear from or that you think that has a story like Lisa, get in touch with with me.
Speaker C:You can head over to nqr media.com that's nqr media.com and there's a drop down for the One Big Thing podcast has contact information.
Speaker C:Get in contact with me.
Speaker C:Let me know who you want me to interview, the topics and things that are meaningful to you.
Speaker C:Because my whole goal with this show is to help you move the ball forward in your life by having the conversations with individuals that can inspire encourage you to Like Lisa said, no, you're not alone.
Speaker C:So, as always, thank you for being my guest on the One Big Thing Podcast, and until next time, we'll talk soon.
Speaker A:Thanks for checking out my show.
Speaker A:If you enjoyed this episode, I'd love for you to write a review or drop a comment wherever you're listening or watching.
Speaker A:And be sure to stay connected.
Speaker A:Did you know you can subscribe to my YouTube channel, which is Eve CampbellPR?
Speaker A:That's Steve Campbell PR and I'm a real person who's reachable.
Speaker A:You can find me on all my socials and connect with me.
Speaker A:If you have topics or guests you'd love to hear from, let me know.
Speaker A:But thanks for being a part of this journey with me.
Speaker A:And until next time, enjoy other episodes of the One Big Thing Podcast.
